Wood Yamaha. Fascinating stuff! Get the Best of Reverb in Your Inbox Subscribe. Be aware that sizes may or may nor conform to an exact measurement. Cymbal finish : Again, this one's easier for new cymbals zildjian cymbal dating it's a fancy way of asking if it's shiny brilliantnormal naturalzildjian cymbal dating, or does it look like it just came out of a cave raw? I agree with K.
Laser Engraving
So, you've got a great sounding vintage Zildjian K ride cymbal but you have zildjian cymbal dating idea when it was made: how do you date your vintage Zildjian cymbal? Most people start by searching the internet and guessing at the age of their cymbal based on what they know. What they know is usually based on the biggest marks on the cymbal: the cymbal stamp and cymbal manufacturer logo if it's not rubbed off. Drummers almost always start with the cymbal stamp since it doesn't rub off.
More often, zildjian cymbal dating, you end up lost in a thread with a mix of helpful posts, and some posts that have nothing to do with your cymbal.
If you're lucky enough to find photos of your cymbal model all you have to do is compare your cymbal to the photo right?! Right, if you know what to look for…, zildjian cymbal dating.
Here's a list of the things that make up a cymbal, focusing on vintage Zildjians. If I missed something get in touch! It might not be totally complete but it's a good starting point if you're totally lost in drum forums full of drum nerd talk. A quick note, a lot of this info was pointed out to me by Steve Blackwhose cymbal research uses statistics to build on the work of Bill Hartrick's original Zildjian stamp timeline, zildjian cymbal dating.
I made an illustrated gallery for all zildjian cymbal dating visual learners. These cymbals aren't vintage Zildjian cymbals but have easy to spot visual examples of the cymbal characteristics above.
Not vintage, but awesome!! Also a good example of how hand-hammering looks on different finishes, zildjian cymbal dating. An example of the painted model and the manufacturer stamp. This ride cymbal is unlathed no rings going around the cymbal. The faint dots are the machine hammering marks. This one's easy to identify from the machine-hammered radial pattern with huge hammer marks! It's also got typical modern Zildjian lathing including the bell and zildjian cymbal dating glossy, zildjian cymbal dating, brilliant finish a little less brilliant from age and use, zildjian cymbal dating.
Z Customs aren't always considered vintage Zildjian cymbals but useful as an example. These ones aren't vintage Zildjian but I'm including them to make a point. The bottom hi hat cymbal in the photo is an awesome, zildjian cymbal dating, hand-made boutique cymbal by TRX!
It has a raw finish with a one of a kind copper color, hand-hammering that looks like leopard spots and hand-lathing that makes dark irregular grooves with an unlathed cymbal bell.
Compare the raw finish to the brilliant finish on the top hi hat barely visible on the right. What we just went over was a lot, zildjian cymbal dating, but now that you've looked at all your cymbal's characteristics how do you find the year of your cymbal? If you're able to find other pictures of vintage Zildjians that match some of your cymbals' characteristics you can get a good idea of what year or era it was made in.
But what if you can't? So, zildjian cymbal dating, how do you decide when your Zildjian was made? One of the best perks of my job is the people I meet and connect with on a day to day basis. One of those people is Steve Black, a trained statistician researching Zildjian and Paiste cymbals.
A while back Steve contacted me about an 18˝ Avedis cymbal I had on the site zildjian cymbal dating I thought was from the '80's. Thanks again Steve! Not everyone's lucky enough to have someone doing cymbal research get in touch with them through their website. That's exactly why Steve's been putting his research on his Avedis Zildjian Timeline since Although the other timelines out there are pretty good, no one's using stats the way Steve is, zildjian cymbal dating.
One reason I'm trying to get people to use his timeline is that it doesn't always come up as high in searches as other ones. It also contains a ton of info so here's some links to get you started:.
Know a resource I'm missing? Let me know and I'll get it on the list! Or drop a comment below…. Date Your Vintage Zildjian K Cymbals: Steve Black's Zildjian Stamp Timeline. Right, if you know what to look for… Identifying zildjian cymbal dating vintage cymbal: things to look for! If you learn with your eyes don't worry, I'll have a gallery after the list with examples.
Cymbal Characteristics: Cymbal manufacturer stamp : A manufacturer's mark that's usually engraved by laser in the surface of the cymbal or stamped into the zildjian cymbal dating alloy, especially on vintage cymbals. Laser stamps happened to Zildjians in Cymbal size : Grab your yard stick or tape measure.
Manufacturer sizes aren't exact, zildjian cymbal dating, a 20˝ cymbal can actually be slightly larger or smaller than 20˝. Fun fact: Zildjian cymbal dating As were made in huge sizes of 24˝ and 26˝ zildjian cymbal dating far back as !
By the way, if you want to get really accurate you can even measure your cymbal bell! Cymbal weight : Vintage cymbals, zildjian cymbal dating, Zildjians included, often weighed less than newer cymbals so drummers often give weights in grams g as a clue to when they were made. Rough weights for medium lines of cymbal are g for 22˝, g for 20˝ and g for 18˝, zildjian cymbal dating.
If yours zildjian cymbal dating lighter than that you've got a clue that it's an older Zildjian. Cymbal centerhole : Usually you're looking at size.
Manufacturers often change the sizes of cymbal holes. There's one other thing to look for: grommets. If you see a small metal ring in the centerhole you've got an old marching cymbal. Manufacturing process : Cymbals are stamped from bronze sheets, hammered or hand-hammered. This can be hard to tell but is more obvious on vintage or boutique cymbals.
Cheap cymbals are stamped zildjian cymbal dating bronze sheets with more expensive lines cast from bronze and hammered by machine, giving consistent hammering patterns. Hammering pattern : Related to the manufacturing process.
Hand-hammered patterns are a little less precise or straight-up uneven: especially when the cymbals are shock cooled from a zildjian cymbal dating temperature. Lathing pattern : This is the pattern of rings that go from the cymbal's outer edge in to the centerhole or bell. Most cymbals are lathed, although some are partly zildjian cymbal dating with raw unlathed bells or no lathing at all sometimes called blanks. This one's easy for new cymbals but tough for vintage ones.
Once the paint gets rubbed off from cleaning it's easy to mistake a hi hat cymbal for a small crash or even a splash cymbal. Old cymbal catalogs often have the sizes of the cymbals for a given year but if your hi hat is the same size as a crash for that year you have to find another way to identify the cymbal.
Cymbal finish : Again, this one's easier for new cymbals — it's a fancy way of asking if it's shiny brilliantnormal naturalor does it look like it just came out of a cave raw? Zildjian first advertised brilliant finish cymbals in their catalog in This can also be misleading since older brilliant finish cymbals have a patina that can look like they had a natural finish.
Natural finish cymbals can also be polished to a more brilliant finish. Cymbal Holes : Sometimes cymbals have holes drilled in them besides the centerhole to change their sound. Example: check out this vintage Zildjianzildjian cymbal dating, zildjian cymbal dating thanks to Steve Black. Cymbal Sound : Identifying a cymbal by sound is tough! It's pretty subjective and requires a lot of experience but can be useful as a last resort. The good news is I've started recording my cymbals including in videos on my YouTube channelto provide drummers and percussionists the ultimate resource.
If you don't know what cymbal you have, check out my videos to help you narrow it down by look and sound. By the way, all the audio and video of my cymbals is professionally recorded for accurate sound! Here's a gallery with examples of cymbal terms: I made an illustrated gallery for all you visual learners.
Check it out and hover over the images for more info on the cymbals:. Zildjian K Custom Hybrid Crash Cymbal. Zildjian Amir Impulse Ride. Zildjian Z Custom Medium Crash Cymbal.
TRX Dark Hi Hat Cymbals. The short answer: Steve Black's Zildjian Stamp Timeline One of the best perks of my job is the people I meet and connect with on a day to day zildjian cymbal dating. It also contains a ton of info so here's some links to get you started: Avedis Zildjian small stamps : SSA vs. SSB Zildjian's changing centerhole sizes Zildjian's different eras of hammering patterns Avedis Zildjian bell lathing patterns Again I can't recommend Steve's work enough!
If you have a questions, ask them there. Forums are full of drummers who know more than you, zildjian cymbal dating, just take it with a grain of salt and do your homework. Bud Stein's cymbal weight calculator. You can use zildjian cymbal dating to ballpark zildjian cymbal dating weight of your cymbal. This is more useful for drummers with vintage cymbal experience but beginners can compare it to eBay ads for similar cymbals that have weights listed.
The Hazelshould vintage cymbal and drum zildjian cymbal dating. Check here to see if you can find a picture of your vintage Zildjian or Paiste, Bosphorous, Ufip, Sabian, Istanbul Agop or Istanbul Mehmet. Jollity's Drum Farm Cymbal Listings. Another resource for vintage Zildjian cymbal pictures. eBay searches. This might be obvious, but I've ID'd plenty of cymbals buy searching for the size and make of a vintage cymbal and going through pictures on eBay listings.
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Thread starter trappemann Start date May 5, Tags who knows the truth? trappemann Very well Known Member. Joined Jul 6, Messages Reaction score 85 Location Maryland. I spoke with a gentleman at the Zildjian factory the other day, who has been there for a very long time.
Over 30 years. He told me that stamps are not an indication of age. Different stamps were used interchangeably throughout the years, some just to keep trademarks alive and that sometimes, different stamping machines might have 3 or 4 different stamps going at once, in the interest of production. Only since they started serial s recently, could you tell age.
I found it interesting, but mostly, disappointing. Can anyone prove otherwise? noahJT prone to DFO-UI. Joined Jul 23, Messages 2, Reaction score Location Los Angeles, CA. He's trolling us!!!! DFO Star Silver Supporting Member. Joined Aug 5, Messages 21, Reaction score 4, Location Illinois. If he's been there 30 years that means he started in the 's which means he probably doesn't really know much about things that happened in the 's, 50's, 60's or even 70's.
Most music companies seem to have little regard for their past history as far as keeping track of minor production details beyond advertising angles "since " or "Drum Makers since " as their whole focus is on selling new products right now and in the future.
There is no real incentive other than good public relations for them to be able to tell you anything about a product that they produced 50 years ago. Almost all the information that is available about vintage drums and cymbals has been gathered up by enthusiasts who are outside of the companies that made the products. This is where we get serial number tables and cymbal stamp timelines that can help us get ballpark ideas when something was made.
The hand hammering and the varying thicknesses also mean that each cymbal is highly individual, consider it like speaking with an accent. This is good in so far as there is an enormous palette to draw upon from the vintage cymbals out there but bad in as much there must be some not-so good ones in there. This means that yeah whilst you may find an amazing unique cymbal there is also a risk in purchasing vintage cymbals from the web as there is in purchasing anything that cannot be seen or that sounds different on audio.
Caveat Emptor! This entry was posted by admin on January 27, at am, and is filed under Dating Vintage Zildjians. Follow any responses to this post through RSS 2. Responses are currently closed, but you can trackback from your own site. Vintage Zildjians. Vintage Zildjians For Sale ». Buying and Selling Vintage Zildjian Cymbals A Vintage Zildjian Cymbal is for sale but all you have to go on is an ebay ad or maybe you want to auction one of your own cymbals and you have a bunch of questions.
big stamp first stamp how to date a cymbal makers mark sixties stamp stamp thin stamp trans stamp vintage what is a vintage cymbal zildjian. In addition, Avedis models were uniformly produced in machine hammering by the middle of the decade.
These unusual specimens were specifically used by Zildjian when they began producing brilliant finish cymbals. The CO stamps were the last unique signatures on Zildjian models until the company introduced their laser engraving system in Beginning in , Zildjian introduced a laser-engraved serial number on the bottom of the stamp for easy identification. The two letters at the beginning of the numerical sequence distinguish the year.
Your purchases also help protect forests, including trees traditionally used to make instruments. Reverb Articles. First, pre-trans stamp. Trans stamp. Large stamp. Small stamp. CO stamp. ID - IE - IF - IG - IH - II - JJ - JA - JB - JC - JD - JE - JF - JG - JH - JI - AJ - AA -
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